1972 Lemans QUESTIONS before I buy! - Pontiac GTO Forum
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-04-2005, 02:14 PM Thread Starter
 
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1972 Lemans QUESTIONS before I buy!

I know someone that is selling a 1972 Lemans. They say the car is all original. I am uncurtain of this so I was wondering if you could help me.

It is a Sundance Orange 1972 Pontiac Lemans Convertible with a tan top. They told me it had a small block 400 under the hood and the ONLY thing on the car that wasn't original was the new edelbrock carb. The car is in excellent shape only minor surface rust spost on the edge of the hood and the lower back quarterpanel around the wheel. They are asking only $2500 for the car. I have the cash and I am ready to buy it HOWEVER I have a a few snags.

The VIN number I got off the car (on the top drivers side dash) read as follows: 237671P124867

Does this number even sound right? From what I read I dont think this is the right VIN number. Can anyone help PLEASE.

IF the number is right what do you think about the price. Rember the car is an automatic with electric seats, electric convertible top and electric mirrors. PLEASE HELP!
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-06-2005, 01:54 PM
 
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That VIN does not look like a '72 Pontiac number. It appears to be the VIN from a 1971 (the sixth number in the VIN is the year).

In 1972, a LeMans will have a number that looks like this:

2D67T2P124867

The "2" means it's a Pontiac
"D" in 1972 was the code for a LeMans
"67" is Convertible (37 is hardtop)
"T" is the code for a 400 engine
"2" is 1972
"P" (or whatever letter) is the code for the assembly plant - P is Pontiac)
124867 is the assembly sequence number

There is no "small block" 400 in a Pontiac. All Pontiac blocks are the same external size from 326 thru 455.

If the block is original it will have the VIN number stamped into the front face of the block, passenger side, just above the oil pan rail and next to the timing chain cover. It will also have a 2-letter code stamped into the block on the passenger side, forward face, just below the cylinder head gasket. A 1972 400 will be a YX, YZ, ZR, ZV, ZX, WK, WS, YS, YT, or XS.
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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-06-2005, 04:49 PM Thread Starter
 
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what now

So what should I do now? It seems as if the VIN# has both the convertible and the hardtop number BUT it has a 1 instead of a 2 meaning that it would be a '71. I am still uncurtain as to why it would have BOTH hardtop and convertible numbers and a date that doesn't match. I heard that the convertibles have a totally different VIN but I do not know if that is a true statement. Is $2500 still a good deal on a near mint 197? Lemans convertible?

Last edited by Hazieview; 07-06-2005 at 04:58 PM.
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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-06-2005, 08:29 PM
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In 1971 The 37 indicates the car is a Lemans Sport, I believe YS is the engine code in 71 for the 400 used in the Lemans Sport, My opinion, the car is a good deal at $2500.


1st digit - Division - 2 = Pontiac

2nd & 3rd digits - Series:
33 = Tempest (1965-70)
33 = LeMans T-37 (1971)
35 = Tempest Custom (1965-70)
33 = LeMans (1971)
37 = Tempest LeMans (1965-70)
37 = LeMans Sport (1971)
39 = Tempest Safari (1967-69)
42 = GTO (1966-71)

4th & 5th digits - Body Code:
07 = 2-door sedan (post)
17 = 2-door coupe
27 = 2-door sedan (post)
35 = 4-door wagon, 2 seat
36 = 4-door wagon, 2 seat,
dual action tailgate
37 = 2-door coupe
39 = 4-door coupe
46 = 4-door wagon, 3 seat,
dual action tailgate
67 = 2-door convertible
69 = 4-door sedan

6th digit - Model Year:
5 = 1965
6 = 1966
7 = 1967
8 = 1968
9 = 1969
0 = 1970
1 = 1971
7th digit - Assembly plant:
A = Atlanta, GA
B = Baltimore, MD
C = Southgate, CA
D = Doraville, GA
E = Linden, NJ
G = Framingham, MA
K = Kansas City, MO
P = Pontiac, MI
R= Arlington, TX
U = Lordstown, OH
V = Bloomfield, IL
X = Kansas City, KS
Z = Fremont, CA
1 = Oshava, Ontario Canada

Last 6 digits - Production sequence starting at 600001
at all plants, except V8 models which started at 100001.

1971 Lemans Sport Convertible;


1972 Lemans Sport convertible;


Pontiac's 1971 engine codes,

Year,Code,CID,HP,carb

1971 WR 350 250 2
1971 WU 350 250 2
1971 WN 350 250 2
1971 WP 350 250 2
1971 XR 350 250 2
1971 YU 350 250 2
1971 YN 350 250 2
1971 YP 350 250 2
1971 WS 400 265 2
1971 WX 400 265 2
1971 XX 400 265 2
1971 YX 400 265 2
1971 WK 400 300 4
1971 WT 400 300 4
1971 YS 400 300 4
1971 WG 455 280 2
1971 YG 455 280 2
1971 WJ 455 325 4
1971 YC 455 325 4
1971 WL 455 335 4
1971 WC 455 335 4
1971 YE 455 335 4

Randy



Last edited by 05GTO; 07-06-2005 at 09:23 PM.
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-08-2005, 12:43 AM Thread Starter
 
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i think it is legit

I think the car VIN is all good. My buddy said that even though the body style is a '72 it was still made in '71. Which makes since. Just like you can actually buy a 2006 car in 2005. I think $2500 is a steal. Any ideas as to what I could do to the egine with out decreasing the all original value?
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-08-2005, 07:38 AM
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The casting number should be 481988 for the 400 in 1971, 1972 and 1973. This is found on the distributor pad for 1964, 1965, 1966, and the first part of the year in 1967. Then midway through 1967 it was moved to the back of the block behind the number 8 cylinder.

Modifying the engine should not effect the value as long as the numbers match.

More info on the engine codes;

The Engine Code can be found on the front of the engine block. It is stamped on the right hand bank on a machined pad. The engine code is directly below the engine production number.

Engine Code
123456
WS
22P100001


123456 -Engine Production Number
(No correlation to the Vehicle VIN)
WS -Engine Code
22P100001 -Engine VIN Code
added late 1967. (2=Pontiac, 2=Model Year, P=Pontiac Assembly Plant, 100001=Last six numbers of the car VIN)

Randy



Last edited by 05GTO; 07-08-2005 at 07:43 AM.
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-10-2005, 12:29 AM Thread Starter
 
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Good news

The 1971 Pontiac Lemans Sport Convertible is now owned by me. I did a little more research than the actual owners. The car IS actually a 1971 Pontiac Lemans Sport Convertible as I just said above. The title and VIN# both back this fact. It absolutely 100% all original. The car is in excellent shape. The Top has a small tear in it and the back glass has fallen out, however the interior was not harmed AT ALL from this because the car was garaged kept everyday. I washed the car and tommorrow I will wax it and detail the interior. It has minor rust bubles around the front of the hood wear it closes and minor rust bubles on the passenger side lower quarter panel beside the wheel. I have never seen an original car in this good of shape. The Electric top still works and so does the seat, the seat is however, a little slugish and could use oil. The original AM/FM radio can still pick up stations and play music (it could use a little work but it DOES WORK). INCREDIBLE. The engine runs as smoothe as it they did when they rolled out of the factory. I am %100 happy with this find. The price I payed wasn't exactly what I wanted but I thought it was well worth it to purchase the car. I mean come on, a %100 original 1971 Lemans Sport Convertible with minor rust? Who whouldn't buy this beaty. It is sundance orange with a tan top. I may not be afford to keep this beauty because I live in some apartments in which I label as "the ghetto" (it's close to work and cheap to live there). So the car might get a new price tag after I put a few $$$ in it. Keep it in mind if this car is what you are looking for then hey maybe it is the car for you. Otherwise I'll keep you posted. Thanks ALL!!! Have fun! Always remember Classics can NEVER get old!!!!!!!!
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post #8 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-10-2005, 11:33 AM
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Congratulations,

Here is a 71 Lemans Sport Convertible for sale thru Chicago Car Exchange, the person who sold you the car did not have a clue of it's value. Great find!

http://www.hemmings.com/index.cfm/fu...icle_id/220427

Randy


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  Pontiac GTO Forum > The 1964-1974 Pontiac Tempest, Lemans & GTO > 1964-1974 Tempest, Lemans & GTO General Discussion

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